shriver, his children and so on. they're all very important to him. he loves them all, but at the end of the day it's about arnold and, therefore, he can compartmentalize a lot of these things that he has done and say, yes, this was off script, yes, this was a mistake, yes, this was stupid, but he won't admit that it was a betrayal, that it was something that was absolutely horrible. >> so is this -- when you see this, do you see pathology, or does this look like normal regular, you know, guy thing like, oh, okay, i screwed up, a made a mistake, i made a stupid thing. move on. >> i certainly do see pathology here because this is a man who is involved in a lot of -- using a lot of defense mechanisms. he uses a lot of regression where he admits that something has happened, such as the birth of his son with his housekeeper, but then, you know, shuts that away and may say, well, i didn't really acknowledge it until years later when he started looking like me.